The End in the Beginning– SHOW DISCUSSION

Hehe...'we're not Brennan, we can guess'...lol

the number of upcoming fanfics....I can't even begin to imagine how many there are going be!

Just saw the epi and what Im thinking is that they didnt have anything itneresting to put in the finale so they just came up with some silly story which has nothing to do with the plot and all. It just turned into some silly soap opera where they creating crazy obstacles to prevent the main characters to fall in love/ be together/ whatever. Im not very exited about next season cuz if this is the way its heading ( soap opera) then Im done with it. Gutted.

Sorry you didn't like it, Pete. I loved it...it was fun. But everyone's different. I hope you don't give up on it, though.

It wasn't a dream, it wasn't a book...what was it then, Hart? Do YOU even know at this point, because half the things you promised us this season didn't happen. 'A meeting of two minds'. Umm. Okay. I don't know what part of his words I should believe anymore anyway. All of the writers.

He had an adverse reaction to the anesthesia. Wouldn't that affect his memory temporarily? Probably? I'm just trying to make sense of it all.

And almost half of the front page of the Bones section at FFN is already post-eps. Time to sift through and find the legitmately decent ones.

Hart is just stirring up the fandom. He seems to come from the RDM school of thinking: "Get them up in arms - And laugh" .lol. I love RDM, so of course, I love that. Also, it appears HH has recently graduated in doublespeak and hinting: "the Gravedigger will be back" Sure it was. "The sex will be real" Of course, just in a different reality altogether.

If he was being less than absolutely colorful, there was a theory posited in the spoiler chat (by milky, I think) that maybe she was reading out loud throughout the entire story (*shrug* I always read what I write) and thus influenced Booth's dream....I can get behind that.

And Vodzu, they really have been thinking about this for almost two seasons, so while I get your anger, it's not for lack of interest that it turned out how it did. Now, if this was a JJ-show we were talking about....but let's not

MoonlightGardenias wrote:It wasn't a dream, it wasn't a book...what was it then, Hart? Do YOU even know at this point, because half the things you promised us this season didn't happen. 'A meeting of two minds'. Umm. Okay. I don't know what part of his words I should believe anymore anyway. All of the writers.

He had an adverse reaction to the anesthesia. Wouldn't that affect his memory temporarily? Probably? I'm just trying to make sense of it all.

And almost half of the front page of the Bones section at FFN is already post-eps. Time to sift through and find the legitmately decent ones.

Personally there's a part of me that is cynically saying this is HH's reaction to the tidal wave of tweets that were calling for his head last night. But what the hell, let me give the man the benefit of the doubt one more time (third time's the charm, right?), and assume he's not lying his ass off this time. In that case, if one wants to be positive and hope for the best, then he could be saying that the entire AU was something they both experienced, Brennan in the writing of it and Booth in the dreaming of it. This isn't as far off as it seems now, Brennan saw Teddy Parker after all, and so much is made of their deep connection, of their ability to have complete conversations without speaking, etc, that maybe the key to this is the narrated bit about two people leading the same life.

In this scenario his question, "Who are you?" isn't amnesia, it's confusion. Imagine poor Booth in the midst of the most realistic dream ever, one in which all of his fantasies are a reality and he's married to the woman he loves, she's having his baby, life is finally good, and then he comes to and sees her sitting over him but instead of seeing his wife he has a rush of conflicting memories. Is she Bren or is she Bones? "Who are you?" isn't amnesia, it's his attempt to discern which was the dream and which the reality. You want complications for season five, how about her just coming to terms with being in love with him and him now wanting it all, just being with her isn't enough he wants marriage and children as well. That's real relationship drama that can really screw a couple up. If, and I stress if because its all pure speculation, that's what HH is talking about was something like that then I'd retract everything I said about the episode and acknowledge it as the greatest head fake in TV history.

On the flip side, he could just be lying to us again and I will eventually have to lay a beat down on his ass. I'm still working through some issues at this point.



RM

heirofloki wrote:If he was being less than absolutely colorful, there was a theory posited in the spoiler chat (by milky, I think) that maybe she was reading out loud throughout the entire story (*shrug* I always read what I write) and thus influenced Booth's dream....I can get behind that.

I like that theory better than the one I posited. I really do need to get more than three or four hours sleep a night before posting.

RM

heirofloki wrote:Hart is just stirring up the fandom. He seems to come from the RDM school of thinking: "Get them up in arms - And laugh" .lol. I love RDM, so of course, I love that. Also, it appears HH has recently graduated in doublespeak and hinting: "the Gravedigger will be back" Sure it was. "The sex will be real" Of course, just in a different reality altogether.

If he was being less than absolutely colorful, there was a theory posited in the spoiler chat (by milky, I think) that maybe she was reading out loud throughout the entire story (*shrug* I always read what I write) and thus influenced Booth's dream....I can get behind that.

And Vodzu, they really have been thinking about this for almost two seasons, so while I get your anger, it's not for lack of interest that it turned out how it did. Now, if this was a JJ-show we were talking about....but let's not

Honestly, I think you're giving HH too much credit. If he were really so crafty and manipulative this season wouldn't have been the nose dive and finale crash that it was. In my opinion nof course. I think he's trying too hard to make everyone happy and appeal to the diverse demographic of viewers in order to keep ratings up instead of preserving the integrity of the story.

Shelly wrote:

heirofloki wrote:Hart is just stirring up the fandom. He seems to come from the RDM school of thinking: "Get them up in arms - And laugh" .lol. I love RDM, so of course, I love that. Also, it appears HH has recently graduated in doublespeak and hinting: "the Gravedigger will be back" Sure it was. "The sex will be real" Of course, just in a different reality altogether.

If he was being less than absolutely colorful, there was a theory posited in the spoiler chat (by milky, I think) that maybe she was reading out loud throughout the entire story (*shrug* I always read what I write) and thus influenced Booth's dream....I can get behind that.

And Vodzu, they really have been thinking about this for almost two seasons, so while I get your anger, it's not for lack of interest that it turned out how it did. Now, if this was a JJ-show we were talking about....but let's not

Honestly, I think you're giving HH too much credit. If he were really so crafty and manipulative this season wouldn't have been the nose dive and finale crash that it was. In my opinion nof course. I think he's trying too hard to make everyone happy and appeal to the diverse demographic of viewers in order to keep ratings up instead of preserving the integrity of the story.

Heh, I really hate to agree with you because I so want to believe the way heirofloki does, but if he was as good as all that Season Four wouldn't have been so uneven, nor had so many WTF?! moments in it. There's a reason I call it the "What the hell were they thinking?!" season. So many wonderful episodes mixed in with so much dross that there's no real sense of direction for most of the season. Still, I'm going to go against my nature and put on some rosy hued glasses and tell myself that HH really is as good as his press releases say, and this was all one gigantic masterful head fake, and season five will be every shippers dream come true, and unicorns really do exist, and Emily will show up on my doorstep and beg me to run away with her...

RM

If you're gonna dream, dream big.

THX1138 wrote:

MoonlightGardenias wrote:It wasn't a dream, it wasn't a book...what was it then, Hart? Do YOU even know at this point, because half the things you promised us this season didn't happen. 'A meeting of two minds'. Umm. Okay. I don't know what part of his words I should believe anymore anyway. All of the writers.

He had an adverse reaction to the anesthesia. Wouldn't that affect his memory temporarily? Probably? I'm just trying to make sense of it all.

And almost half of the front page of the Bones section at FFN is already post-eps. Time to sift through and find the legitmately decent ones.

In this scenario his question, "Who are you?" isn't amnesia, it's confusion. Imagine poor Booth in the midst of the most realistic dream ever, one in which all of his fantasies are a reality and he's married to the woman he loves, she's having his baby, life is finally good, and then he comes to and sees her sitting over him but instead of seeing his wife he has a rush of conflicting memories. Is she Bren or is she Bones? "Who are you?" isn't amnesia, it's his attempt to discern which was the dream and which the reality. You want complications for season five, how about her just coming to terms with being in love with him and him now wanting it all, just being with her isn't enough he wants marriage and children as well. That's real relationship drama that can really screw a couple up. If, and I stress if because its all pure speculation, that's what HH is talking about was something like that then I'd retract everything I said about the episode and acknowledge it as the greatest head fake in TV history.

On the flip side, he could just be lying to us again and I will eventually have to lay a beat down on his ass. I'm still working through some issues at this point.



RM

I really really hope you're right RM but I don't know I keep watching that last scene and Booth's eyes and it really seems to me like he's saying "who the hell are you?" lol

I felt like he didn't show any sign of recognition despite how much I wanted him too.

It's only confussion, it's only confussion... maybe if we keep on repeating, it'll become real... Or AU real... Just don't know. All I can say is that I am confussed, and i'm not just awaken for a coma... I could handle a 2chapter amnesia it'd be interesting... the interaction after all the wave of feelings that flooded Bren, despite of her denial. But more than that would be an abuse. I'm trying hard to convince myself that s5 is right there, and that we'll have promos or spoilers or whatever in a few days. And in the while I think I'll be searching more meeting-of-two-minds examples to be able to understand that man... I accept suggestions.

heiro, what the RDM school?

THX1138 wrote:...Still, I'm going to go against my nature and put on some rosy hued glasses and tell myself that HH really is as good as his press releases say, and this was all one gigantic masterful head fake, and season five will be every shippers dream come true, and unicorns really do exist, and Emily will show up on my doorstep and beg me to run away with her...

Yeah, that's exactly how it will be! [Only admins are allowed to see this image]

DBCrazy wrote:heiro, what the RDM school?

Heeh. RDM = Ronald D. Moore. He was the Executive Producer of the new Battlestar Galactica and he seemed to love getting people all riled up. (LOL) He was always pretty up-front about the fact that, although they appreciated fan input, they wrote the stories they wanted to write and hoped people liked them. But if they didn't...Well, they didn't. What you gonna do about it.

The podcasts for that show were always a fantastic listen. Great insight into the process of making a show.

Okay, I'm here to comment. Please remove any small children or those with sensitive ears, or eyes, away from the computer.

COMMENT RATED M for
-ADULT LANGUAGE
-POSSIBLE VIOLENCE

-_-_-_-_-_

WHAT THE HELL! That episode sucked! I hated it with a passion. I felt like shooting my TV after watching it. AMNESIA!!?!?!?!?!?! What?!

That whole dream thing was silly. The night club thing, with the alter-ego doppelgangers (yes I am trying to use big words to sound smart ), but seriously WTF?!?!?!?!?!

The whole dream thing was ridiculous. It was silly, even more so than this show usually is. This was annoyingly silly as opposed to funnily silly.

AAAAAAAAAAAGGGGH!!!!!!11!!!!!!1!!!!1!!!!!!!!!11

[Only admins are allowed to see this image]

Am I wrong or Brennan's ring in the first scene is different from the one in the AU? It would be another sign that the first scene represents the future and is not part of the AU...

Or that the illusion was being constructed by both of them (Booth dreaming, Bones writing).

Either way, phenomenal catch, whitebones! Eagle eyes!

Either way, phenomenal catch, whitebones! Eagle eyes!

THANK YOU!!!!!! *hugs you*

a380fan wrote:Okay, I'm here to comment. Please remove any small children or those with sensitive ears, or eyes, away from the computer.

COMMENT RATED M for
-ADULT LANGUAGE
-POSSIBLE VIOLENCE

-_-_-_-_-_

WHAT THE HELL! That episode sucked! I hated it with a passion. I felt like shooting my TV after watching it. AMNESIA!!?!?!?!?!?! What?!

That whole dream thing was silly. The night club thing, with the alter-ego doppelgangers (yes I am trying to use big words to sound smart ), but seriously WTF?!?!?!?!?!

The whole dream thing was ridiculous. It was silly, even more so than this show usually is. This was annoyingly silly as opposed to funnily silly.

AAAAAAAAAAAGGGGH!!!!!!11!!!!!!1!!!!1!!!!!!!!!11

So just hazarding a guess here, but you didn't care for the finale?



Seriously, I get where you're coming from. I'm on record as thinking the Amnesia bit was an epic fail, although I actually enjoyed the AU/dream bit up until then.

RM

whitebones86 wrote:[Only admins are allowed to see this image]

Am I wrong or Brennan's ring in the first scene is different from the one in the AU? It would be another sign that the first scene represents the future and is not part of the AU...

YES!!! This is what I was going to look for today and I posted over in the "AU" thread. I thought that they were different!

heirofloki wrote:

DBCrazy wrote:heiro, what the RDM school?

Heeh. RDM = Ronald D. Moore. He was the Executive Producer of the new Battlestar Galactica and he seemed to love getting people all riled up. (LOL) He was always pretty up-front about the fact that, although they appreciated fan input, they wrote the stories they wanted to write and hoped people liked them. But if they didn't...Well, they didn't. What you gonna do about it.

The podcasts for that show were always a fantastic listen. Great insight into the process of making a show.

I think RDM actually APOLOGIZED for "Black Market." Worst. Episode. Ever.

Sorry, just a sidenote...and now back to Bones!

heirofloki wrote:Or that the illusion was being constructed by both of them (Booth dreaming, Bones writing).

Either way, phenomenal catch, whitebones! Eagle eyes!

However, Booth is NOT wearing a wedding ring in the opening scene. Why would AU Booth NOT be wearing a ring? Did he take it off to go to sleep? Doubtful, IMO. This would mean that they are engaged, not married and that it is indeed a flash forward.

I am as confused as everyone else is...I don't think we are ever going to really find out until Hart Hanson takes pity on us and give us what we really want

New observation: 1. Booth isn't wearing a wedding ring AT ALL during the entire episode, AU or not. Bizarre.
2. Brennan says "Cam" when talking about her detective skills. Why would she say that if she just met her? Wouldn't it be "Detective Saroyan?"

Something I noticed the first time around, but that I am trying to really figure out this time: all of the MATH references. I have lost count of the number of times people use "do the math" or "it all adds up to..." or "I'm not a mathemetician..." What does it mean? It is used multiple times during the Booth/Birimbau scene when they are both in handcuffs at the FBI/.